"Open debate only is useful when everyone debating agrees on the premise. "
This, this, this, this, THIS!
I can't help noticing two things about the "open debate" conversations:
1. It's always being upheld by people with the least skin in the game. I recently saw a post that read: Some of you have never had to fight for your human rights, and it shows. Both-siding/all-siding conversations about human rights is a real tell that you have never had to fight for yours.
2. It's like none of the open debate folks have ever encountered the tolerance paradox, or if they have it's been so surface level they have never taken it to it's conclusion which is that we must never tolerate intolerance of human lives and embodiments. People who refuse to censor hate speech seem to think all speech is created equal and therefore intolerance of the opinions of Nazis is the same as intolerance of a difference of opinion about a movie. These false equivalencies are dangerous and willfully ignorant of systemic oppression.
Anyway - I'm ignoring the hellscape of Notes and sticking with the newsletter blog part of the platform.
Ok, I have never heard the term "tolerance paradox" before, and I had to go look it up, and I wish I had known it before now! Thank you!
But also to your point, yes. When the debate is academic and won't change your life or the lives of anyone you personally know, what do words really matter? But when the debate is an attempt to get someone to view you like enough of a human person that they might think to vote in favor of your Not Dying Today (or getting attacked, or imprisoned, or access, or or or), then words really matter.
I too am going to leave Notes alone--both because I am skeptical and because I already engage on Substack plenty, and the writing has to get done somehow. I really hope the newsletter blog remains the flagship product for Substack going forward.
Yup, yes, absolutely. All of this, Garrett, and the fact that Substack seems to be painting this really weird altruistic picture about Notes makes me more worried about the cracks, not less. Especially because it was released at nearly the same time as the community fundraising. Especially especially because they made the interface look SO similar to Twitter. There are other ways to add "microblogging" to a platform--Tumblr had it from the get-go, and it looks very different.
I also agree that I don't think there's anything nefarious going on, and the part of Substack that is good is still good! And fingers crossed it will stay that way for years to come. 🤞 Thank you for your thoughtful comments!! 💖
Garrett, good comments. It's somewhat depressing if Substack is in any kind of financial trouble. I've only been on here since Jan and have been loving it, so I'd hate to think that there might be any issues in terms of longevity.
I've used Notes and enjoyed it, but I'm all too conscious that it isn't what I'm here for. I like the slower, longform pace of articles. I *do* enjoy the engagement and discovery of other writers that Notes has brought about, but I may have been lucky in my small-ish circle of connections (and their connections). It does seem to currently be writers talking with writers, which is totally fine by me but I suspect that wasn't the original intention of it. I'm not sure how many readers-only are using it.
I'm going to keep dipping in and out, but I will limit my time there.
To Elnora: I need to digest this article in full, but thank you for posting, as always.
Hopefully they aren't in financial trouble *yet*, it just looks.....less than ideal. Also hopefully Substack will continue to exist for a good long while--they are my only author website right now! It would honestly be amazing if Notes is or becomes a place of positive interaction for all.
Also also, digest away, and thank you for your thank you 😊
Great further comments Garrett, thanks. Hmm, lots to mull on. If any ads start appearing on the platform, then I'll figure we're in a dire situation. But for now, it's a watch and see I guess. Thanks again.
Hi Kri! I can't take credit for the transcription--the whole interview has a transcription if you scroll down on The Verge website (that link is above the bit I quoted). But I'm glad you found it helpful!!
Oh that's so interesting, I didn't know there are fines for not moderating in Europe (hooray EU!). We'll have to see what happens on Substack going forward.....
"Open debate only is useful when everyone debating agrees on the premise. "
This, this, this, this, THIS!
I can't help noticing two things about the "open debate" conversations:
1. It's always being upheld by people with the least skin in the game. I recently saw a post that read: Some of you have never had to fight for your human rights, and it shows. Both-siding/all-siding conversations about human rights is a real tell that you have never had to fight for yours.
2. It's like none of the open debate folks have ever encountered the tolerance paradox, or if they have it's been so surface level they have never taken it to it's conclusion which is that we must never tolerate intolerance of human lives and embodiments. People who refuse to censor hate speech seem to think all speech is created equal and therefore intolerance of the opinions of Nazis is the same as intolerance of a difference of opinion about a movie. These false equivalencies are dangerous and willfully ignorant of systemic oppression.
Anyway - I'm ignoring the hellscape of Notes and sticking with the newsletter blog part of the platform.
Ok, I have never heard the term "tolerance paradox" before, and I had to go look it up, and I wish I had known it before now! Thank you!
But also to your point, yes. When the debate is academic and won't change your life or the lives of anyone you personally know, what do words really matter? But when the debate is an attempt to get someone to view you like enough of a human person that they might think to vote in favor of your Not Dying Today (or getting attacked, or imprisoned, or access, or or or), then words really matter.
I too am going to leave Notes alone--both because I am skeptical and because I already engage on Substack plenty, and the writing has to get done somehow. I really hope the newsletter blog remains the flagship product for Substack going forward.
The Tolerance Paradox is amazing! I'm so glad you know about it now. I wish it was taught in basic curriculums from like, ages ten up, to be honest.
I would vote for that!
Yup, yes, absolutely. All of this, Garrett, and the fact that Substack seems to be painting this really weird altruistic picture about Notes makes me more worried about the cracks, not less. Especially because it was released at nearly the same time as the community fundraising. Especially especially because they made the interface look SO similar to Twitter. There are other ways to add "microblogging" to a platform--Tumblr had it from the get-go, and it looks very different.
We shall see!
I also agree that I don't think there's anything nefarious going on, and the part of Substack that is good is still good! And fingers crossed it will stay that way for years to come. 🤞 Thank you for your thoughtful comments!! 💖
Garrett, good comments. It's somewhat depressing if Substack is in any kind of financial trouble. I've only been on here since Jan and have been loving it, so I'd hate to think that there might be any issues in terms of longevity.
I've used Notes and enjoyed it, but I'm all too conscious that it isn't what I'm here for. I like the slower, longform pace of articles. I *do* enjoy the engagement and discovery of other writers that Notes has brought about, but I may have been lucky in my small-ish circle of connections (and their connections). It does seem to currently be writers talking with writers, which is totally fine by me but I suspect that wasn't the original intention of it. I'm not sure how many readers-only are using it.
I'm going to keep dipping in and out, but I will limit my time there.
To Elnora: I need to digest this article in full, but thank you for posting, as always.
Hopefully they aren't in financial trouble *yet*, it just looks.....less than ideal. Also hopefully Substack will continue to exist for a good long while--they are my only author website right now! It would honestly be amazing if Notes is or becomes a place of positive interaction for all.
Also also, digest away, and thank you for your thank you 😊
Great further comments Garrett, thanks. Hmm, lots to mull on. If any ads start appearing on the platform, then I'll figure we're in a dire situation. But for now, it's a watch and see I guess. Thanks again.
Hi Kri! I can't take credit for the transcription--the whole interview has a transcription if you scroll down on The Verge website (that link is above the bit I quoted). But I'm glad you found it helpful!!
Oh that's so interesting, I didn't know there are fines for not moderating in Europe (hooray EU!). We'll have to see what happens on Substack going forward.....